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| techtalk:ref:svcproc11 [2021/08/23 06:45] – [Removing the Primary Drive] hippysmack | techtalk:ref:svcproc11 [2025/08/05 05:02] (current) – [Shift Forks] hippysmack | ||
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| ===== Sub-Documents ===== | ===== Sub-Documents ===== | ||
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| - | * [[techtalk: | + | * [[techtalk: |
| + | * [[techtalk: | ||
| ====== Transmission Removal / Installation ====== | ====== Transmission Removal / Installation ====== | ||
| - | The original XLF thread was written by Hippysmack of the XLFORUM ((http:// | ||
| Also reference the sub documents above for a more in-depth look at the shifting mechanism and associated issues with it. \\ | Also reference the sub documents above for a more in-depth look at the shifting mechanism and associated issues with it. \\ | ||
| Click on any pic below to enlarge: \\ | Click on any pic below to enlarge: \\ | ||
| Line 52: | Line 52: | ||
| The detent arm below shows signs on scoring and they are deep across the arm in one place. \\ | The detent arm below shows signs on scoring and they are deep across the arm in one place. \\ | ||
| - | | 1998 1200S Primary ((photo by Hippysmack of the XLFORUM | + | | 1998 1200S Primary ((photo by Hippysmack of the XLFORUM |
| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
| ====== Removing the Primary Drive ====== | ====== Removing the Primary Drive ====== | ||
| - | |||
| See also [[techtalk: | See also [[techtalk: | ||
| **Note**: | **Note**: | ||
| Line 78: | Line 77: | ||
| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
| - | | | + | | |
| - | | Engine and Clutch | + | | Engine and clutch |
| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
| Line 87: | Line 86: | ||
| They are less likely to slip and round off the edges of the nuts. Impact-type sockets may be too thick to fit. \\ | They are less likely to slip and round off the edges of the nuts. Impact-type sockets may be too thick to fit. \\ | ||
| - | {{: | + | {{: |
| **The engine sprocket and clutch hub should be removed as one unit**. \\ | **The engine sprocket and clutch hub should be removed as one unit**. \\ | ||
| Line 106: | Line 105: | ||
| However they come off is fine as long as they are not dropped. \\ | However they come off is fine as long as they are not dropped. \\ | ||
| - | {{: | + | {{: |
| Make sure you already have a place to put them and a clear walking path before removing them from the engine. \\ | Make sure you already have a place to put them and a clear walking path before removing them from the engine. \\ | ||
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| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
| - | ====== Inspection ====== | + | |
| + | ====== Disassembly ====== | ||
| + | You can do this with the tranny laying on a bench but it's easier to prop the shaft ends up so you can lift gears and use both hands on retainers and such. \\ | ||
| + | You can use soft jaws in a bench vise to hold the assembly. \\ | ||
| + | You can also cut the outer race off the old main and countershaft bearings with a Dremel to use the inner races as a press block for new bearings. \\ | ||
| + | The main inner race also doubles as a stand for the mainshaft to keep the threads safe in a vise. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | {{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ====== Inspection | ||
| Once the tranny is out and before disassembly, | Once the tranny is out and before disassembly, | ||
| Line 128: | Line 137: | ||
| {{techtalk: | {{techtalk: | ||
| - | ====== Disassembly ====== | + | ===== Shift Forks ===== |
| + | The shift forks will probably have some side wear marks (which may not be a problem but more of a symptom). \\ | ||
| + | Check the inside contact surfaces for scoring / wear on the edges. \\ | ||
| + | The ones below all have a small amount of wear with the middle one having a wave of wear on the inside surface where it should contact the gears. \\ | ||
| + | Worn contact area equals more space between it and the gears than intended which adds to slop. \\ | ||
| + | The used fork ends below were .202" on both inside and outside edges. \\ | ||
| - | You can do this with the tranny laying on a bench but it's easier to prop the shaft ends up so you can lift gears and use both hands on retainers and such. \\ | + | |{{techtalk: |
| - | You can use soft jaws in a bench vise to hold the assembly. \\ | + | |
| - | You can also cut the outer race off the old main and countershaft bearings with a Dremel to use the inner races as a press block for new bearings. \\ | + | |
| - | The main inner race also doubles as a stand for the mainshaft to keep the threads safe in a vise. \\ | + | |
| - | |{{techtalk: | + | |{{techtalk: |
| - | ====== Transmission Gears ====== | + | Check the fork ID's to make sure they are all the same. The ones below are all 1.248" |
| + | Excess clearance in the fork to shift drum bore contributes to binding of fork movement. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | Check the holes in the side of each fork where the metal dowel pin slides in. The holes should be round. \\ | ||
| + | The ones below were more oval shaped from side wear / mis-movement and two of the solid dowel pins measured .579" with another measuring .576". \\ | ||
| + | These oval shaped holes contribute to the binding of shift fork movement and roughing up the sides of the pin channels in the shift drum. \\ | ||
| + | It's best to replace forks with wallowed out pin holes. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| \\ | \\ | ||
| - | ===== Countershaft Gears ===== | ||
| + | Below are pics of the shift drum with the fork and fork pin positions for each gear. \\ | ||
| + | You can see at what point along the channel in the shift drum that the forks and their corresponding pins rest per gear select. \\ | ||
| + | With the tranny on the bench, if you notice a lot of movement in a fork, the pin never comes out of it's corresponding channel. \\ | ||
| + | The entire transmission has a certain amount of slop on it's own (on the bench). \\ | ||
| + | But one reason for noticeable slack/ | ||
| + | If the fork is moving, it's traveling along the drum's channel (left to right). \\ | ||
| + | And all 3 forks have enough designed slack in them to act somewhat independant of each other even though they are all key to the drum. \\ | ||
| + | Another reason could be wobbled out holes in the forks where the pins install. \\ | ||
| + | Another reason could be a worn oil boss in the bottom of the channel or simply a worn out channel itself. \\ | ||
| + | The pin being in a straight portion of the channel keeps down side to side movement. \\ | ||
| + | But the pins were not deigned to have a rigid seating and will still allow some fork movement. \\ | ||
| + | And always remember the entire tranny will have flex all around it if it's not affixed on both ends. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | Click on any pic to enlarge: ((drawings by Hippysmack)) \\ | ||
| + | {{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | {{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | {{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Countershaft / Mainshaft ===== | ||
| + | The thrust washers used on the shafts most likely won't all be the same thickness (even when new due to quality control). \\ | ||
| + | The used ones below varied from .0675" to .068". New ones are generally around .069". \\ | ||
| + | You can also put the mainshaft, countershaft and shift drum between centers and check for warp-age or roll them on a thick piece of (clean) glass. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Shift Drum ===== | ||
| + | |||
| + | You may find abrasions on the outside edge of the shift drum channels where the solid pins ride. \\ | ||
| + | These may have come from worn forks or pins that direct the forks. \\ | ||
| + | If they are not too rough and don't have any gouges that would hinder the pins from moving, you can polish the roughness out. \\ | ||
| + | Using something like 600 grit wet/dry sandpaper and steel wool you may be able to salvage the drum. \\ | ||
| + | Check the raised area in the center of each dowel pin channel for damage or wear. \\ | ||
| + | The raised bump running the channel for the dowel pins provide a surface for the pins to ride on. \\ | ||
| + | Also oiling underneath the pins happens in the valley below created by the raised runner. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | If any of these conditions exist and can not be repaired, the drum must be replaced. \\ | ||
| + | Rough edges on the channels can hang up the pins and hinder shift fork movement causing missed shifts / damaged gears. \\ | ||
| + | An uneven pin runner will not allow proper oiling and will also hinder shift fork movement. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | You can test pin movement by sliding a dowel pin down the channels by hand (it as in normal operation) and see if it runs smooth or binds / catches during travel. \\ | ||
| + | It's not on the inside but just on the outer edge of the slot. \\ | ||
| + | In the pics below, 3rd gear pin position on the drum suffered from a not entirely gone but erosive raised up area in the channel. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | Measure the shift drum pins. They should all be the same length from the drum face (installed height .326" - .334" | ||
| + | However, it is common for some or all of them to pull out of the drum a little. \\ | ||
| + | Some (most) just knock the pins back in the drum with a hammer. And some pull add Loctite to the side of the pins before knocking them back in. \\ | ||
| + | If you pull a pin out to add Loctite, it'd be best to use it on the sides of the pin (not bottom or not in the drum holes). \\ | ||
| + | Then Loctite should remain in the nooks and crannies between the pin and hole but not in the hole center to block the pin from going home. \\ | ||
| + | If it gets in the hole center, it will hydro-lock the pin and not let it go all the way home. \\ | ||
| + | Keep in mind that hot Loctite may either let go or slide so that may either stop or slow down a moving pin . \\ | ||
| + | See also [[techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Trap Door ===== | ||
| + | Check the trap door with a straightedge to insure there is no warp-age. \\ | ||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Shifter Detent Plate ===== | ||
| + | You may find the shifter detent plate to be leaning at an angle with scoring on the outside face. \\ | ||
| + | This is a common condition due to the drum pins walking out of the drum at different times and lengths. \\ | ||
| + | The detent plate below was found to be leaning and none of the pins were the same length out of the drum. \\ | ||
| + | Also check the depth of the holes the back of the plate that go onto the shift drum pins. They should all be the same depth. \\ | ||
| + | When the pins are forced out of the drum by the shift pawl, the pressure can make the holes too deep making proper re-alignment impossible. \\ | ||
| + | See also [[techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | If you haven' | ||
| + | The original detent plate (33656-90 ) which is now obsolete, is made of an aluminum alloy and has longer (slower) drop points for the detent arm. \\ | ||
| + | The -90A is a smaller diameter plate with more radical shift curves and a more positive ‘lock in’ with sharper drops than the old one. \\ | ||
| + | See also [[techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Shifter Shaft ===== | ||
| + | The shifter shaft will flop around with the primary cover and that is normal due to the way it is designed. \\ | ||
| + | The primary cover only gives the shaft a place to rest (does not make the shaft rigid during operation). \\ | ||
| + | There are plenty of ways the shaft can turn, twist and move around during operation. The clearances in the parts allow this to happen by design. \\ | ||
| + | But there are times when some of the parts wear and add extra clearances which makes shifting more difficult. \\ | ||
| + | See also [[techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | |This clearance around the spring coil gives the \\ shift arm's willingness to lean. ((photo by Hippysmack))| | ||
| + | |{{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | The mounting plate (shift shaft to case) does not keep the shaft rigid when holding it by hand mostly due to the coil spring between it and the shaft. \\ | ||
| + | The plate pulls up or down tension against the healthy spring that's wrapped around the shift shaft and returns the shaft to " | ||
| + | While this is normal, the spring has 2 fingers on the end controlling up and down play between the mounting plate and the shaft. \\ | ||
| + | The distance between the fingers can extend over time which allows back and forth wiggle of the shift pedal before a shift is actually initiated. \\ | ||
| + | You can use some pliers to squeeze those fingers together (closer to their grab points on the shifter assembly). \\ | ||
| + | Soon after in operation, the spring will still widen a little from where you compressed it, but it should be a small amount. \\ | ||
| + | So if you have more .010" clearance between the spring and plate hook, you can shorten that clearance to get a little less slop there. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | The spring below was adjusted to " | ||
| + | However, after a couple thousand miles, the spring arms did spread out a little (app .009") yet doesn' | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | There is a bushing behind the shift pawl and one side of it has a flush cut end with the other side having a rounded end. \\ | ||
| + | This is by design to allow the pawl to have side movement to line up with the pins by gravity before grabbing them. \\ | ||
| + | So there is a bit of slop there but that is normal. \\ | ||
| + | However, that bushing will wear down and a new one should leave a little less slop there. \\ | ||
| + | The more slop there, the farther the pawl will lean but pawl leans by design to a degree. \\ | ||
| + | The more side play after the designed amount may allow the pawl to pull a pin out farther (if a pin is in the condition to walk out anyway). \\ | ||
| + | And you may gain several thousandths of meat back with a new spacer. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | | Shift Pawl Bushing ((photo by xLoneRiderx of the XLFORUM https:// | ||
| + | |{{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | The inner shaft bushing is not a press fit into it's primary case bore but a loose fit and will be easy to slide in and out of the bore. \\ | ||
| + | Some have tossed ideas of using a Loctite sealer around the bushing or pinning the bushing in place. \\ | ||
| + | But the primary cover sets the shaft' | ||
| + | Unless you can guess correctly where the resting position of the shaft will be, constraining the bushing can lead to binding the shaft and bushing wear later. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | | Inner shaft bushing clearance. ((photos by Hippysmack)) | ||
| + | |{{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | There is a clearance between the inner shaft bushing and the mounting plate due to the coil on the shaft spring. \\ | ||
| + | You may not get any free horizontal play thru the bushing / shaft movement (IF) you don't let the coil space on the spring collapse in your hand. \\ | ||
| + | But you may get .050" or more play there if you push the plate over the free space near the coil. \\ | ||
| + | Worn spacers can add to that clearance. The amount of free clearance there contributes to excess shaft axial movement and shaft slop. \\ | ||
| + | You can use a thicker washer between the plate and spring to beef up that connection and leave a little less slop there. \\ | ||
| + | The shaft will " | ||
| + | |||
| + | |{{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Clutch Basket / Starter Ring Gear ===== | ||
| + | The back side of the teeth on the starter ring gear may have some wear where they rub against the shifter shaft arm or detent plate. \\ | ||
| + | This shouldn' | ||
| + | The rough edges on the starter sprocket can smoothed down with sandpaper or a wire brush if desired. \\ | ||
| + | See also [[techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | The starter ring gear is pressed onto the rear of the clutch basket and has been known to slide rearward away from it. \\ | ||
| + | This may never happen as it doesn' | ||
| + | There are plenty of loose clearances in the shift chain that could cause contact but most of these involve only momentary contact. \\ | ||
| + | But there should be clearance between the shift arm and starter ring gear if you lift the shift shaft to the upper extreme. \\ | ||
| + | A measurement was taken between the arm and gear with a feeler gauge at .043" (1.0922mm) without any scrubbing noticed (shaft lifted up by hand w/ cover off). \\ | ||
| + | This dim is just a dirty one and results will vary. But the point of that measurement is there is that there will be some clearance between the two. \\ | ||
| + | If the arm stays against the ring gear when the shaft is lifted, check the starter ring gear for breakage or slippage. \\ | ||
| + | | ||
| + | {{techtalk: | ||
| + | |||
| + | {{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Transmission Gears ===== | ||
| + | Gear Positions. \\ | ||
| + | {{: | ||
| + | |||
| + | ==== Countershaft Gear Pics ==== | ||
| | Countershaft 5th - 25 teeth || | | Countershaft 5th - 25 teeth || | ||
| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
| Line 156: | Line 329: | ||
| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
| - | ===== Mainshaft | + | ==== Mainshaft |
| | Mainshaft 4th – 32 teeth || | | Mainshaft 4th – 32 teeth || | ||
| |{{techtalk: | |{{techtalk: | ||
