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techtalk:ref:engmech05k [2021/07/25 20:52] hippysmack [Parts] |
techtalk:ref:engmech05k [2023/12/22 14:52] (current) hippysmack [Parts] |
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| The oil is supposed to settle out in this little drain chamber and drain back to the motor thru the tiny hole in the cavity. \\ | The oil is supposed to settle out in this little drain chamber and drain back to the motor thru the tiny hole in the cavity. \\ | ||
| Crankcase air/oil mist rises up in each rocker box, hits the umbrella thus separating the oil from the air at that point. \\ | Crankcase air/oil mist rises up in each rocker box, hits the umbrella thus separating the oil from the air at that point. \\ | ||
| - | In theory, collision is the recipe for separating the oil mist from the air. \\ | + | By design, collision is the recipe for separating the oil mist from the air and the umbrella valves are the last collision point in the system. \\ |
| Most of the oil falls off the bottom of the umbrella back into the lower rocker box section where it falls back down into the engine. \\ | Most of the oil falls off the bottom of the umbrella back into the lower rocker box section where it falls back down into the engine. \\ | ||
| The residual air pressure runs past the umbrella, out a hole in each middle rocker section to a hollow bolt in each head (breather vents). \\ | The residual air pressure runs past the umbrella, out a hole in each middle rocker section to a hollow bolt in each head (breather vents). \\ | ||
| Line 24: | Line 24: | ||
| That alone should improve the condition some. \\ | That alone should improve the condition some. \\ | ||
| - | The umbrella valve hole is the one in the left picture below with 3 roughly oval shaped holes around the install hole in the corners of the middle rocker box. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ | + | The umbrella valve hole is the one in the left picture below with 3 roughly oval shaped holes around the install hole in the corners of the middle rocker box. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/181820-do-i-have-to-remove-heads-to-change-cams/page5?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ |
| (2 umbrella holes per middle box spacer, only 1 is used per cylinder on the each intake side as the box spacer is interchangeable front to rear) \\ | (2 umbrella holes per middle box spacer, only 1 is used per cylinder on the each intake side as the box spacer is interchangeable front to rear) \\ | ||
| The 3 oval shaped holes are where air/oil mist enters the separation chamber while lifting the umbrella up. \\ | The 3 oval shaped holes are where air/oil mist enters the separation chamber while lifting the umbrella up. \\ | ||
| The drain back hole is the tiny little hole to the right of the sideways 13 in the picture. \\ | The drain back hole is the tiny little hole to the right of the sideways 13 in the picture. \\ | ||
| Oil is also pulled down that tiny hole by vacuum on each upstroke. \\ | Oil is also pulled down that tiny hole by vacuum on each upstroke. \\ | ||
| - | {{:techtalk:evo:engmech:rocker_box_mod_by_aswracing.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=5&t=1958462)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:rocker_box_breather_chamber_pic1_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Hippysmack)) \\ | + | {{:techtalk:evo:engmech:rocker_box_mod_by_aswracing.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by aswracing of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/181820-do-i-have-to-remove-heads-to-change-cams/page5?page=5&t=1958462)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:rocker_box_breather_chamber_pic1_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Hippysmack)) \\ |
| - | **The Slobber Stoppers are an attempt to (possibly help) curtail the issue of puking oil out the breathers**. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ | + | **The Slobber Stoppers are an attempt to (possibly help) curtail the issue of puking oil out the breathers**. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/181820-do-i-have-to-remove-heads-to-change-cams/page5?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ |
| However, the first answer would be to address other known factors for wet sumping. \\ | However, the first answer would be to address other known factors for wet sumping. \\ | ||
| The rocker box middles use the same casting for both the front and rear cylinder. And there's a facility for the umbrella valve on both ends of each middle spacer. \\ | The rocker box middles use the same casting for both the front and rear cylinder. And there's a facility for the umbrella valve on both ends of each middle spacer. \\ | ||
| Line 45: | Line 45: | ||
| * (1) 1/8" drill bit to enlarge the drainback hole in the drain pool. | * (1) 1/8" drill bit to enlarge the drainback hole in the drain pool. | ||
| * Instructions | * Instructions | ||
| + | |||
| + | The measurements in the drawing below should considered (rough dims) as neither of the barrels included in that kit were identical. ((salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) \\ | ||
| + | |||
| (click on a pic to enlarge): \\ | (click on a pic to enlarge): \\ | ||
| - | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_instructions_pic3_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Drawing by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) \\ | + | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_instructions_pic3_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Drawing by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) \\ |
| - | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_pic1_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_pic2_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) \\ | + | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_pic1_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_pic2_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) \\ |
| - | {{:techtalk:evo:engmech:rocker_box_mod_3_by_toe.jpg?direct&300|}} ((toe of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4641942#post4641942)) {{:techtalk:evo:engmech:rocker_box_mod_2_by_toe.jpg?direct&300|}} ((toe of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4641942#post4641942)) | + | {{:techtalk:evo:engmech:rocker_box_mod_3_by_toe.jpg?direct&300|}} ((toe of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/159043-bestest-rocker-gasket-set-needed#post3380382)) {{:techtalk:evo:engmech:rocker_box_mod_2_by_toe.jpg?direct&300|}} ((toe of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/159043-bestest-rocker-gasket-set-needed#post3380382)) |
| \\ | \\ | ||
| - | Below are app. dims of the barrel taken by XLForum member, salmanmr. \\ | + | Below are app. dims of one of the barrels in this kit taken by XLForum member, salmanmr. \\ |
| - | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stopper_dim1_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stopper_dim2_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) \\ | + | Note: The barrels in this kit were not identical. \\ |
| + | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stopper_dim1_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stopper_dim2_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) \\ | ||
| ====== Installation ====== | ====== Installation ====== | ||
| Pics of the instructions: (click on a pic to enlarge). Also see other commentary below: \\ | Pics of the instructions: (click on a pic to enlarge). Also see other commentary below: \\ | ||
| - | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_instructions_pic1_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_instructions_pic2_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5906708#post5906708)) \\ | + | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_instructions_pic1_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:slobber_stoppers_instructions_pic2_by_salmanmr.jpg?direct&300|}} ((Photo by salmanmr of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-general-discussion-and-problems/24593-another-oil-mist-problem-slobber-stoppers/page2#post4515537)) \\ |
| ===== Tapping the Holes for the Barrels ===== | ===== Tapping the Holes for the Barrels ===== | ||
| Line 107: | Line 111: | ||
| (another way to keep from having to grind the cover) \\ | (another way to keep from having to grind the cover) \\ | ||
| {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:rocker_box_breather_chamber_pic2_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Hippysmack)) \\ | {{:techtalk:ref:engmech:rocker_box_breather_chamber_pic2_by_hippysmack.jpg?direct&300|}} ((photo by Hippysmack)) \\ | ||
| - | |||
| ===== Clearancing the Barrel(s) (if needed) ===== | ===== Clearancing the Barrel(s) (if needed) ===== | ||
| Line 116: | Line 119: | ||
| "Measure twice / cut once" so you don't take too much off the barrel though. \\ | "Measure twice / cut once" so you don't take too much off the barrel though. \\ | ||
| Clean the barrel of all debris and do the test fit again. Make sure the .015" clearance is there now. Repeat if needed. \\ | Clean the barrel of all debris and do the test fit again. Make sure the .015" clearance is there now. Repeat if needed. \\ | ||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| - | |||
| ===== Clearancing the Cover (if needed) ===== | ===== Clearancing the Cover (if needed) ===== | ||
| Line 136: | Line 135: | ||
| The kit comes with an 1/8" drill bit to enlarge the drainback hole in the drain pool chamber. But be aware that; \\ | The kit comes with an 1/8" drill bit to enlarge the drainback hole in the drain pool chamber. But be aware that; \\ | ||
| Each motor has different conditions and what works for one may not for another. \\ | Each motor has different conditions and what works for one may not for another. \\ | ||
| - | Drilling that drain hole may allow more crankcase pressure to escape the engine when it's supposed to escape thru the umbrella. \\ | + | Drilling that drain hole may allow more crankcase air/oil mist to escape the engine on downstroke when it's supposed to escape thru the umbrella. \\ |
| - | When the umbrella closes, the only intake of air is that tiny drain. \\ | + | When the umbrella closes (upstroke), the only intake of air is that tiny drain hole. \\ |
| And IF there is not enough oil in that cavity to drain back, it may allow too much atmosphere to come back into the motor. \\ | And IF there is not enough oil in that cavity to drain back, it may allow too much atmosphere to come back into the motor. \\ | ||
| Added air intake may promote wet sumping. So make sure not to wobble the hole any larger than the bit. \\ | Added air intake may promote wet sumping. So make sure not to wobble the hole any larger than the bit. \\ | ||
| It may be a trial and error thing and if you do one mod at a time, you'll know more about what worked and what didn't. \\ | It may be a trial and error thing and if you do one mod at a time, you'll know more about what worked and what didn't. \\ | ||
| + | The engine is designed to have a slight vacuum in the breathing system on the inside of the motor. \\ | ||
| + | On upstroke, the vacuum pulls oil down to the boxes thru that drain hole. It's too small for gravity to flow oil. \\ | ||
| + | Enlarging the hole, especially too much, will allow vacuum to drain the oil faster, which gives more time to suck in air before piston direction changes again. \\ | ||
| - | You could first try and chamfer the umbrella hole to 60º (included angle) countersink bit and not drill out the drainback hole. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ | + | You could first try and chamfer the umbrella hole to 60º (included angle) countersink bit and not drill out the drainback hole. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/181820-do-i-have-to-remove-heads-to-change-cams/page5?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ |
| - | However, to the extent the drain back hole is enlarged, it bypasses the umbrella valve back into the boxes. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ | + | However, to the extent the drain back hole is enlarged, it bypasses the umbrella valve back into the boxes. ((aswracing of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-motor-engine/sportster-motorcycle-motor-top-end/181820-do-i-have-to-remove-heads-to-change-cams/page5?page=5&t=1958462)) \\ |
| Maybe 1/8" isn't enough to cause an issue according to the makers of Slobber Stoppers. \\ | Maybe 1/8" isn't enough to cause an issue according to the makers of Slobber Stoppers. \\ | ||
| But inhalation/exhalation is what carries oil out the breathers so you don't want to bypass it any more than necessary. \\ | But inhalation/exhalation is what carries oil out the breathers so you don't want to bypass it any more than necessary. \\ | ||
| Line 149: | Line 151: | ||
| And with this mod being undo-able by swapping the front and rear middles, you have a safety net in case something goes wrong. \\ | And with this mod being undo-able by swapping the front and rear middles, you have a safety net in case something goes wrong. \\ | ||
| - | **Another suggestion is to enlarge the tiny oil drain from ~.070" to .09375" along with the threaded insert oil standoffs**. ((toe of the XLFORUM http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4641942#post4641942)) ((http://xlforum.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1703706&page=2)) \\ | + | **Another suggestion is to enlarge the tiny oil drain from ~.070" to .09375" along with the threaded insert oil standoffs**. ((toe of the XLFORUM https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/159043-bestest-rocker-gasket-set-needed#post3380382)) ((https://www.xlforum.net/forum/sportster-motorcycle-forum/sportster-motorcycle-era-specific-and-model-specific/frame-mount-evo-sportster-talk-1986-2003-models/159043-bestest-rocker-gasket-set-needed/page2?t=1703706&page=2)) \\ |
| Slightly enlarging the little hole lets the oil drain back easier. Air that enters this oval(ish) chamber has to go somewhere. \\ | Slightly enlarging the little hole lets the oil drain back easier. Air that enters this oval(ish) chamber has to go somewhere. \\ | ||
| So it goes out the big hole on top, thru the breather bolts and out. The threaded insert just provides a lip around the hole. \\ | So it goes out the big hole on top, thru the breather bolts and out. The threaded insert just provides a lip around the hole. \\ | ||
| So any oil that drops out of suspension around the air hole won't drain out the breather. It just makes it a little bit harder for oil to go out the breather. \\ | So any oil that drops out of suspension around the air hole won't drain out the breather. It just makes it a little bit harder for oil to go out the breather. \\ | ||
| + | |||
| + | ===== Install the Rocker Boxes ===== | ||
| + | Before installing the rocker boxes back on the motor, make sure they are clean from all dirt, debris, shavings etc. \\ | ||
| + | It won't hurt to spray them down with carb cleaner etc. before installing the umbrellas. The instructions say to install new umbrellas anyway. \\ | ||
| + | Make sure both the umbrellas and their now counterpart Slobber Stoppers goes on the intake side on each cylinder. \\ | ||
| + | Visually inspect that either gasket does not pinch or pooch out after you tighten up the cover bolts. \\ | ||
| + | If so, loosen or remove the cover and tighten them again or it'll leak oil. \\ | ||
| + | **Cover bolt torque is 10-13 in-lbs** (FSM says ft-lbs but this is wrong). \\ | ||
| + | OEM cover bolts have a washer pressed onto the bolt with a corresponding fiber washer added for each bolt. \\ | ||
| + | Some aftermarket kits have the fiber washers and copper washers. Use either / or but not both types of washers together. \\ | ||
| + | If reusing fiber washers, (not recommended), check them to make sure the fiber hasn't already began imploding. If so, do not use the offending washers. \\ | ||
| + | Vacuum from the rocker box area will eventually implode the fiber washers (looks like an O-ring around the threads and the washer OD is smaller than new ones). \\ | ||
| + | If there are any air leaks around the cover bolts, even with the Slobber Stoppers added, you may still get oil out the breather vent(s). \\ | ||
| + | |||
| \\ | \\ | ||
